the buldge busting kits

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carload9
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Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

the buldge busting kits

Postby carload9 » Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:41 pm

Lee & Redding make a bb kit, maybe some other companies.

Most go thru easy but some is a two arm venture. l want to put some levers on GREEN RCBS ROCK CRUSHER and use my leg like some chineese contraption. Its incredible how much pressure it takes sometimes just for 9mm. The thick brass of the head rim goes thru whole die and dont get one locked up in exit tube.

Not many buldge bust. l like preping brass as much as possible. Many steps. Even ss wash and the lizard litter after that, looks like gold when completed. All bad brass is gone after all these steps, even micro splits are found or caught later with cartridge gage at end.

Actually need a dang motor & wonder if you could convert a Lee bullet feeder to a pistol case feed for bb kit, NOW THAT WOULD REALLY BE NICE.

fmj3
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Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:00 pm

Re: the buldge busting kits

Postby fmj3 » Tue Jan 13, 2015 9:45 pm

carload9 wrote:Lee & Redding make a bb kit, maybe some other companies.

Most go thru easy but some is a two arm venture. l want to put some levers on GREEN RCBS ROCK CRUSHER and use my leg like some chineese contraption. Its incredible how much pressure it takes sometimes just for 9mm. The thick brass of the head rim goes thru whole die and dont get one locked up in exit tube.

Not many buldge bust. l like preping brass as much as possible. Many steps. Even ss wash and the lizard litter after that, looks like gold when completed. All bad brass is gone after all these steps, even micro splits are found or caught later with cartridge gage at end.

Actually need a dang motor & wonder if you could convert a Lee bullet feeder to a pistol case feed for bb kit, NOW THAT WOULD REALLY BE NICE.


I de-bulge all my .40 match brass and my 2011 limited pistol never hiccups in a match, but I don't do it for my practice ammo.

Just got a 9mm major Open gun and will be de-bulging all the match brass for that pistol thru a Lee 9mm Makarov FCD.

carload9
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Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

yep

Postby carload9 » Tue Jan 13, 2015 10:01 pm

l wish lee had named it "case base swage kit" instead of bb. It just sounds better and thats exactly what the die does at it pushes thru and in the thin wall it pushes that lil' buldge in too.

Now tell the truth, when your pushing 9's thru the makorov die out the top how much force does it take fmj3?

john127
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:44 am

Postby john127 » Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:51 am

I agree that is does take a little extra force over the straight wall cases when pushing a 9mm through the Makarov die, but not as much as you describe. Also, mine takes more force because some have had a sort of rib form at the base from the sizing dies not being tapered enough. It's this 'rib', that's on the thicker web area, that's hard for the bulge buster die to pass.

erle
Posts: 282
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Base Bulging Dies

Postby erle » Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:30 pm

Carload,

I got the Redding CARBIDE die for my .40's & 357sig's. Use it on my Rockchucker press & it doesn't take as much force.

HOWEVER, Redding doesn't make anything for the 9mm. Have to use the Lee & they don't make a CARBIDE. Like you, I just "grin & bear it" when I base bulge my 9mm's. Giving them a good lubeing on my lube pad helps a lot. I tried lube spraying but the lube was too light to help any.

fmj3
Posts: 62
Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:00 pm

Re: yep

Postby fmj3 » Wed Jan 14, 2015 6:20 pm

carload9 wrote:l wish lee had named it "case base swage kit" instead of bb. It just sounds better and thats exactly what the die does at it pushes thru and in the thin wall it pushes that lil' buldge in too.

Now tell the truth, when your pushing 9's thru the makorov die out the top how much force does it take fmj3?


Not much more than the .40 in most cases (about the same as sizing in the Lee U die) - some don't require any force at all. I spray them with One Shot lube currently before "swaging". :P

carload9
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Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

fmj2

Postby carload9 » Wed Jan 14, 2015 6:36 pm

2/3rds dont require must force. Bet rest with a press wont work with mak die. The arbor solved the prob with range brass, u use range brass. l size em dirty and dont waiste lube.

Stop by sometime, i'll let you try that old rbcs press, you will use both arms on some. We can make a youtube of you, hehehe!

What press do you use?
U know a 9 is not a straight walled case and a case base swage die has nothing to do with a thin wall. It does base only. Thin walls can be done with size die. REDDING does not even make a 9 case base swage die.


Arbor/$50@ harbor freight, set gas checks too.

Image

fmj3
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Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:00 pm

Postby fmj3 » Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:42 pm

All of my 9mm stoppages in matches were due to a slight bulge at the very base of the case. If they push thru the Mak die then they chamber - for my guns.

I may just be lucky that I haven't tried to push one thru that has a bad bulge yet.

Just using a Lee turret press - use it for all my swaging and rifle brass processing currently, but thinking about another LM for some rifle processing.

I clean all my range brass first, I just throw a batch in the tumbler whenever I get bored around the house and always have a lot of pre-cleaned brass ready to process/run. Just my OCD. :twisted:

Is that the 1 ton arbor press?

carload9
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Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

fmj

Postby carload9 » Wed Jan 14, 2015 8:09 pm

yea, they were out of 1/2 ton & iam glad they were. I put a long dillon lever/arm i had left over on it. Wish they had ton & 1/2 but this is alrite.

I have been doing gas checks for 380/9. Friend sent me 2 sandwich bags of GC's. I could tell imediate difference. I cast my own and stain 3 times w/hitech supercoat. l shoot 115 and 120gr in my glock 42 & kahr 9.

l toss military brass in can and g.f.i. brass too.

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Hawkmoon
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Re: the buldge busting kits

Postby Hawkmoon » Fri Jan 16, 2015 5:40 pm

fmj3 wrote:I de-bulge all my .40 match brass and my 2011 limited pistol never hiccups in a match, but I don't do it for my practice ammo.

Just got a 9mm major Open gun and will be de-bulging all the match brass for that pistol thru a Lee 9mm Makarov FCD.


Hmmm ...

When I first read this I couldn't figure out how this might help anything, since the 9x18 Makarov is not really the same "caliber" as the 9x17 (.380 ACP) and the 9x19 Luger. So I looked them up in the SAAMI data.

The largest OD for the 9mm Luger (which is at the head end, where bulge removal may be needed) is .3910".

For the 9x18 Makarov, the case OD at the mouth is .3902" and at the head it's .3915".

I initially supposed that using a 9x18 FCD wouldn't do anything to remove bulges in 9x19 cases. Now I wonder if it might not result on trying to squeeze the 9x19 cases to BELOW their proper OD.

carload9
Posts: 2025
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

hm

Postby carload9 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 1:03 am

hm;

this is not glock buldge busting so to speak, this is brass base swaging.

Look up saami specs, that will give your answer.

Lee sells the mak to swage, they know what their selling.

These are around .387 or so, just fine. 1/3 of them can be tough to get thru with a regular press. That why the arbor press is great and gas checking too.

LMAO, not @ you, but those that cant get it,, the whole piece of brass goes totally thru the die and comes out the top. The thick base and rim dwn where the primer is "is" brass, & solid brass.
A buldge in higher up in the thin wall of shell that takes no force.

Lets face it, not many swage and not many use a cartridge gage on 9/45/380 and others.

If LEE thought the 9mm would work they would sell it instead of makorov, l called and ordered and thats first thing that came out of techs mouth. Oh you need the mak die.
Last edited by carload9 on Sun Jan 18, 2015 11:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

fmj3
Posts: 62
Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:00 pm

Re: the buldge busting kits

Postby fmj3 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 9:18 am

Hawkmoon wrote:
fmj3 wrote:I de-bulge all my .40 match brass and my 2011 limited pistol never hiccups in a match, but I don't do it for my practice ammo.

Just got a 9mm major Open gun and will be de-bulging all the match brass for that pistol thru a Lee 9mm Makarov FCD.


Hmmm ...

When I first read this I couldn't figure out how this might help anything, since the 9x18 Makarov is not really the same "caliber" as the 9x17 (.380 ACP) and the 9x19 Luger. So I looked them up in the SAAMI data.

The largest OD for the 9mm Luger (which is at the head end, where bulge removal may be needed) is .3910".

For the 9x18 Makarov, the case OD at the mouth is .3902" and at the head it's .3915".

I initially supposed that using a 9x18 FCD wouldn't do anything to remove bulges in 9x19 cases. Now I wonder if it might not result on trying to squeeze the 9x19 cases to BELOW their proper OD.



The base (right next to the extractor groove) of 90% of the 9mm range brass I pick up is right around .387 - the same as factory unfired 9mm ammo. A small percentage measure over .390 - too far over that and they won't chamber in a gun with a tight chamber.

Any brass over .389 pushed thru the mak FCD carbide ring (which measures .386ish on mine) come out the top at .387-.388 - so I know the brass will chamber. Just gives me more consistent brass and maybe helps get that 30th round in the 170mm mag.

CL's die may have a smaller ring than mine, but I have no problem pushing the 9mm brass thru mine on a LCT. I'm pushing thru cleaned and lubed brass and haven't had any yet that require more than a single arm push.

carload9
Posts: 2025
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

yea

Postby carload9 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:21 am

yea, i'll try 9mm fdc if its here & compare but stick w/smallest die. If theres much force its bad for press's, thats why l bought arbor @ harbor freight, get the 1 ton. Do not get the 1/2 ton.

l wonder if there is any springback. [they said yes]

If i had 6 or 700$ l would buy the case base roll machine that ammo companies use. Oh, well not to soon.

I'll get some pics of gas checking soon.
Last edited by carload9 on Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

fmj3
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Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2013 12:00 pm

Postby fmj3 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:28 am

If I wasn't so dang cheap I'd love to buy one of those Case Pro roll sizers too!!!

carload9
Posts: 2025
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2012 9:52 am

fmj3

Postby carload9 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:58 am

FMJ3

Yea, but you can swing $53 out the door. Harbor freight 1ton arbor. I got pics, and save your press's from unnecessary roughness when gas checks and brass base swaging.

I put longer lever arm on mine/left over dillon arm with ball. one bolt/nut holds it to my steel table, its heavy, it dont move.

I keep everything covered with black pillow cases or towel. Your load room is a great conversation piece with a beer.


I checked 9mm fcd & mak fcd and it was .1


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