I'm getting up on my soapbox!

This is where we can talk about our guns. I'd particularly like to see reviews and range reports of your guns, especially if it is a model that others may not be familiar with.

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darwin
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I'm getting up on my soapbox!

Postby darwin » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:45 pm

I bought a 9mm Rock Island 1911. I've been wanting a 9mm version for a long time. I got the tactical model, which has a beavertail, ambi safety and some fairly nice sights.

I bought a box of Winchester White Box and a box of NATO rounds.

It WOULD NOT extract the empty cases from the chamber! The slide cycled fine, but the case was left behind. I'd have to drop the magazine and cycle the slide again.

I called Armscor and talked to a gunsmith. He gave me a couple if things to try with the extractor. No luck.

I sent it in. Since UPS requires overnight delivery of handguns, that cost me $77. Keep in mind that this is a BRAND NEW GUN.

I got a call from a gunsmith today. He said their pistols won't shoot 115 grain bullets, I need to use 124 grain bullets. He did a tune up and is sending it back.

Needless to say, I'm not a happy camper.

I suspected a tight chamber.

I'll see what happens when I get it back.

Oh, and they don't reimburse shipping charges.

helg
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Postby helg » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:25 pm

You could buy a "calibration set" of recoil springs and switch to weaker direction until you get reliable ejection for the given ammo. Not sure about 9mm 1911, but the set for 45acp e.g. by Wolff is everywhere. Drawback of this approach that if you shoot heavier bullet or hotter ammo, you have to switch back to a heavier spring to prevent shortening lifetime of your frame.

Modern approach to solve the problem is to use so-called "dual action" recoil springs. It is actually two springs: the weak one to guide slide movement until case ejection, and the strong one that acts after ejection to stop the slide from mashing the frame. Here are some dual action recoil springs for the 1911s of various calibers.

http://www.brownells.com/1/3/efk-fire-d ... nt-systems

This is more expensive than just a weaker spring, and even more expensive than the "calibration set". You do not have to change the dual spring when switching ammo. It also increases lifetime of the frame that experiences less hits with the dual spring

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Hawkmoon
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Postby Hawkmoon » Thu Aug 12, 2010 11:27 pm

Darwin's problem is extraction, not ejection. Changing the recoil spring won't do a thing if the extractor is leaving the empty case in the chamber.

Nor will shooting a different weight bullet.

The gunsmith goofed. I believe I saw some follow-up on another forum suggesting that Armscor is taking case of Darwin's problem. I'll stay tuned for the final report.

helg
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Postby helg » Fri Aug 13, 2010 10:03 am

Hawkmoon wrote:Darwin's problem is extraction, not ejection. Changing the recoil spring won't do a thing if the extractor is leaving the empty case in the chamber.

Nor will shooting a different weight bullet.

If the claw does not catch the fired shell, then manually cycling the slide should not extract it either. This is not the case:
darwin wrote:I'd have to drop the magazine and cycle the slide again.
I bet it is just incomplete cycling.

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darwin
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Postby darwin » Sat Aug 14, 2010 12:56 am

They had a fedex guy bring a shipping label which sent it back to them. the head gunsmith is supposed to look at it.

It would only pull the cases out 1/8" at the most. I went ahead and bought a 14 lb (standard for the 9mm) and 12 lb progressive spring from Wolff. Neither one fixed it. Sometimes it would pull the case out 1/4". a couple of times I got it to extract 3 in a row.

I think the chamber is too tight.

I got a stovepipe with a live round when I took it to the range. I had never seen that before either.

I was really pissed about the whole affair and vented in the M1911A forum. I assumed that Ivan would read it and do something about it, but he didn't. I finally emailed him and he got on the ball. He said he's sending me some ammo, too, to make up for the whole mess.

I hope to get my Sporster out of the shop tomorrow. It's been FOUR weeks! :cry:

_JD_
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Postby _JD_ » Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:25 am

You might think about having an Avtec extractor installed.

This article from Hilton Yam addresses some issues with the 1911 in 9mm.
http://10-8performance.blogspot.com/201 ... -1911.html

I don't think I'll ever own a non .45 1911 again after having issues with several models in .40&W unless it's a Springfield EMP, oh I wish they would make a Champion sized EMP with the correct internal dimensions for the 9mm/.40

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Postby Hawkmoon » Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:50 am

_JD_ wrote:You might think about having an Avtec extractor installed.

This article from Hilton Yam addresses some issues with the 1911 in 9mm.
http://10-8performance.blogspot.com/201 ... -1911.html

I don't think I'll ever own a non .45 1911 again after having issues with several models in .40&W unless it's a Springfield EMP, oh I wish they would make a Champion sized EMP with the correct internal dimensions for the 9mm/.40

I own two 1911s in 9mm, one is an older (probably mid-70s) all-steel Colt Combat Commander, the other is a Nighthawk Customs in correct 4-1/4" barrel length. The older pistol was bought used and from the condition of the internals it had a VERY high round count when I bought it. And when I bought it, it would NOT extract a fired case. Period.

A friend, who happens to be an LEO and Colt-certified 1911 armorer, took a look at it and found that the extractor was a .45 extractor. We replaced it with the correct 9mm part and it has been 100 percent reliable ever since.

The Nighthawk? It just shoots everything.

Neither has a ramped barrel. Pretty much every other 1911 maker uses ramped barrels in their 9mm pistols. Colt does not, and the Nighthawk was specified to be as near a clone as possible to a classic Colt.

And shooting an all-steel 1911 in 9mm is a hoot. There is NO recoil. It feels like plinking with a .22. Great fun. Which reminds me, I really have to get a press set up to reload for 9mm.

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Postby darwin » Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:52 am

I forgot to update this when I got it back. The head gunsmith worked on it and it works flawlessly now.

I think it will be good for training purposes - if I teach someone the shooting basics. I have a .22 1911 to start them with, then the 9mm, them the 45s. All the same platform. My other .22s are tiny Sterlings and a Ruger with a 10" barrel - neither good for beginners.

I'm torn whether to start reloading 9mm again or just buy the ammo. I have a few thousand rounds of 45 ACPs loaded up with the components to do another 4,000 rounds, so it isn't like I NEED a lot of 9mm. :D

Thanks for the tip on the extractor.

legion489
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Postby legion489 » Sat Dec 08, 2012 5:51 pm

If you have a 1911 .45, all you need to do is buy a complete 9mm/.38 Super slide (Sarco has them and they are actually very nice), then add a 9mm barrel and a .38 Super barrel and use .38 Super mags for both. I have been told that the 9mm won't work with .38 Super mags, but all my 1911s work fine with 9mm ammo and .38 Super mags so I am happy. The only fly in the soup is .38 Super is hard to find (here at least) and much, much more than 9mm.


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